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-   Hardcore & Emo (https://www.musicbanter.com/hardcore-emo/)
-   -   Emo Class (https://www.musicbanter.com/hardcore-emo/14427-emo-class.html)

littleknowitall 03-09-2006 01:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucienAD
:D can i steal this???

bungalow 03-09-2006 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger
You seem to have missed my point by a mile.
Like I said i`m not saying what is & isn`t emo , i`m just saying that nobody has so far said anything about what bands contributed into emo becoming mainstream and you are just dodging the issue to pick holes on points i`m not even trying to make.
I`m not argueing with you here i`m asking you because so far i`ve not seen you or anybody else answer the question , if the bands he mentioned had no impact into the mainsteam success of emo then who did?
Ok, I know that this was made a few pages back, and I havent finished reading this whole thread yet, but I would like to say: I see where you are coming from Urban, my only problem with your logic is the fact that, though you say emo is "mainstream" I do not belive that it is. It is just a misconception that all of these bands that are "mainstream" are emo, when in fact they are pop punk.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 02:32 PM
But where did that misconception come from?

There must be something in it to link it to emo in the first place.Where else does the stereotypical emo kid come from?

Just as I said earlier most people have a problem calling Green Day a punk band , but their success got people into punk. Who`s to say that people listening to emo didn`t get into it in the same way.

I can remember people on this forum singing the praises of bands like Hawthorne Heights & Fall Out Boy just a few months ago and now those same people dismiss them as being crap.So you have to admit there is truth in what i`m saying.

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 02:35 PM
Uh, Good Charlotte and Simple Plan got me into punk, are they punk? No. Are they being called punk? Yes. I looked more into the genre and started finding out about the circle jerks, crass and all them. There is truth in what you're saying they are gateway bands, but that doesn't make them emo.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 02:37 PM
I never said they were emo.

All i`m saying is I don`t think their contribution to it is being recognised

Electric Ocean 03-09-2006 04:05 PM
Emo Map
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger
But where did that misconception come from?

There must be something in it to link it to emo in the first place.Where else does the stereotypical emo kid come from?

This is basically how I believe the term emo has got so confused and how "emo" has become popular.
http://i2.tinypic.com/r1eted.jpg

Edit: Sorry for the size and, yeah, I don't agree with the threadstarter.

P.P.S: It's late and I've probably left out loads of important bits and scenes but oh well...

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 06:43 PM
You left out some parts, but the whole message and stuff got across fine. I agree with what you're saying on there, and hopefully Don will see how "emo" isn't actual emo.

Mama Booze 03-09-2006 07:39 PM
Don.
I love you.
That was heavenly.
:)

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 08:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electric Ocean
This is basically how I believe the term emo has got so confused and how "emo" has become popular.
Thats fine but 2 things....

You`re using the assumption people either listen to one or the other

Both started off from the same point

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 08:26 PM
Just because they both started off from the same point, doesn't mean they're the same genre. Taking Back Sunday sounds nothing like Circle Takes The Square, I wouldn't group them into the same genre at all. Also bands can be influenced by something. He also said "with no real hardcore attachements" the genre being emotionally driven hardcore, has to have hardcore in it.

bungalow 03-09-2006 08:26 PM
Dude, you are wrong Urban.
Most modern music is stemmed from early blues, but is modern music early blues? No.

And don't say " I never said that these bands were emo"

I know you didnt say that, Don did, and that is why we are telling him he is wrong.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crowquill
Just because they both started off from the same point, doesn't mean they're the same genre. Taking Back Sunday sounds nothing like Circle Takes The Square, I wouldn't group them into the same genre at all. Also bands can be influenced by something. He also said "with no real hardcore attachements" the genre being emotionally driven hardcore, has to have hardcore in it.
Didn`t you say to me in the metal thread that Black Sabbath are no longer considered metal because metal has changed as a genre?

If thats true then why shouldn`t emo change as well , you`ve already said you agree with him it`s started off in the same place.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bungalowbill357
Dude, you are wrong Urban.
I`m not saying i`m right about anything.

All i`m saying is that Don is the only person trying to address why emo became so popular , everybody else picks holes in his arguements yet bury their head in the sand when I ask people to offer an alternative explanation.

bungalow 03-09-2006 08:39 PM
I know, but emo isnt what became popular.
It is pop punk being mislabeled as emo.

And as for what Crowquill said about Black Sabbath, good point, but I think they were never metal in the first place.

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 08:41 PM
This isn't a sabbath debate so shut up about it, we gave facts for all that it doesn't validate your arguement at all.

There is still tons of bands playing real emo, and all the other "emo" bands are basically pop groups with guitars. If you listen to saves the day, taking back sunday, anberlin, bayside, the used etc and all these other supposed "emo" bands you'll realize half it is either pop music or hard rock with post-hardcore influences. They have a genre they belong to it, and its easy to see that. A genre can't change so much as too where its not even the same thing, paramore emotionally driven hardcore? Nope.

bungalow 03-09-2006 08:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don
I'm gonna stop being immature about this now. I just wanna say that it's not the end of the world that you or anyone were wrong and the only reason I resorted to childishness was because several people kept calling me an idiot and a moron, etc. In future, try to respect what others say when you think they're wrong, even if you think they have a hidden agenda. I do like making jokes and making light of situations whilst linking them with facts, but this is presumably unknown by most and seem to think I'm out to prove someone wrong for my own pleasure or whatever. I enjoy having a laugh above all, and I just happened to find it funny when someone resorts to name calling when they believe they're correct. So when I respond, all I'm doing is trying to joke around but at the same time trying my best to educate the misled. But this is a very difficult task because when some people think they have knowledge of a particular concept they will store a construct in their brain and it will almost never be changed. I don't like arguing in topics such as these, so hopefully this will be my last post on the matter.
I find this to be the funniest post in this entire thread.
Good Job Don!

hiu 03-09-2006 08:47 PM
It's quite simple really. Emo as it is known to the mainstream music buying public became popular because some mid 90s bands such as Sunny Day Real Estate dabbled in a sound not unlike that of similar bands around the same time such as Nirvana (they were both Sub Pop bands) but also with this hardcore sound from DC during the 80s. Now of course Cobain dies and the younguns need a new form of music that they supposedly can relate to. We now come to the present day.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 09:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crowquill
This isn't a sabbath debate so shut up about it, we gave facts for all that it doesn't validate your arguement at all.

There is still tons of bands playing real emo, and all the other "emo" bands are basically pop groups with guitars. If you listen to saves the day, taking back sunday, anberlin, bayside, the used etc and all these other supposed "emo" bands you'll realize half it is either pop music or hard rock with post-hardcore influences. They have a genre they belong to it, and its easy to see that. A genre can't change so much as too where its not even the same thing, paramore emotionally driven hardcore? Nope.
Shut up?
Oh dear , shame you had to resort to that.

I can actually see you do have points , I just think you are being extremely naive.Every genre has genuine bands, every genre has bands that jump on the bandwagon or have little to do with the original scene and emo is no different.Emo stopped being just about 'emotional hardcore' years ago , thats where it`s roots came from and now it`s diversified into 'pop music with hardcore influences' as you say yourself.You don`t have to like it but you can`t deny thats what the public mainstream idea of emo is , and that is what it will be remembered as years from now.

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger
I`m not saying i`m right about anything.

All i`m saying is that Don is the only person trying to address why emo became so popular , everybody else picks holes in his arguements yet bury their head in the sand when I ask people to offer an alternative explanation.
Don's initial thread was incorrect, and the source he used was also incorrect. I don't really see what point you guys arguing because all you are really trying to say is these mislabeled "emo" bands are really emo because you think so and so does everyone else in the mainstream (which incase you haven't looked lately, and take for example our last presidential election, is LARGELY uneducated about anything) despite historical inaccuracies. It's like saying to a black person "Hey, you may know more about this, but since me and a bunch of people still think you can have slaves because some media moguls told us you can still have slaves, we have slaves. Think of it this way, it's just an evolution of The Emancipation Proclamation." You aren't right, and you have yet to show any slight proof that you are other than your own misled opinions.

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 09:12 PM
Just because thats the public view of emo, doesn't mean its true. The public view of punk is good charlotte and simple plan. Just because the media took a genre and used it for their own benefit doesn't mean everyone needs to give in and say rites of spring isn't emo anymore my chemical romance is.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 09:14 PM
Yeah but come on look how this arguement has gone so far....

Don - These bands popularised emo

Everybody else - Those bands are not emo you`re talking out your ass

Me - Ok then who did populise it then

Everybody else - Nobody did it`s not mainstream they`re not real emo bands

:rolleyes:

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:14 PM
Oh, just so you know guys, we CAN have slaves, because all the people who fought the Civil War died years ago. RIGHT UBRAN??

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 09:16 PM
Gee, I forgot how popular actual emo is. Can't go a minute without seeing Embrace on MTV or some kid in a indian summer T-shirt.

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:17 PM
Yeah, Hot Topic had like fifty copies of As the Roots Undo on the shelf when I went.

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 09:18 PM
I know and i'm sick of that saetia video that they're ALWAYS playing I mean christ, how long can that song be number one?!

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:19 PM
And like, every scene kid I know is talking about how Electric Human Project and Robotic Empire are the best labels around.

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 09:21 PM
Yeah, its annoying as hell everyone around here is getting into gravity records. They're all over the place, WAY more popular then victory records.

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:22 PM
I tried to buy tickets to see Hot Cross, La Quiete, Funeral Diner, Fighter Hayabusa, and Circle Takes the Square play Warped Tour, but they were sold out!!!

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 09:23 PM
:laughing:

pathetic

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger
:laughing:

pathetic
Ironic.

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 09:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by A_Perfect_Sonnet
I tried to buy tickets to see Hot Cross, La Quiete, Funeral Diner, Fighter Hayabusa, and Circle Takes the Square play Warped Tour, but they were sold out!!!
omg!! Similar thing happened to me. I wanted to see amanda woodward at the tacoma dome. So I tried to sneak in but like there we're kids everywhere in the parking lot and the place was packed full. I didn't get in, but I bought this awesome Orchid sweatband and this cool Ampere trucker hat.

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:26 PM
Welcome the Plague Year's drummer threw up on me!

sleepy jack 03-09-2006 09:26 PM
OMG!!! Neil Perry's lead singer SPAT ON ME at taste of chaos!

A_Perfect_Sonnet 03-09-2006 09:29 PM
Joshua Fit For Battle and Angel Hair were playing this show with My Chemical Romance and the Used, and all the lead singers had this huge orgy right on stage because pretending you're gay is so emo, and emo is mainstream, so pretending you're gay is mainstream!

EDIT: Why don't we have a thread on how emo becoming mainstream has led to increased sales of girl's pants? Does Don have a scholarly article on that?

hiu 03-09-2006 10:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger
Yeah but come on look how this arguement has gone so far....

Don - These bands popularised emo

Everybody else - Those bands are not emo you`re talking out your ass

Me - Ok then who did populise it then

Everybody else - Nobody did it`s not mainstream they`re not real emo bands

:rolleyes:
Good way to ignore my post.

Urban Hat€monger ? 03-09-2006 10:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RazorsInTheNight
Good way to ignore my post.
I wasn`t ignoring it , I think yours was the only one who bothered to answer the question. I was referring to the rest of the thread

Don 03-09-2006 10:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by A_Perfect_Sonnet
Don's initial thread was incorrect, and the source he used was also incorrect.
I couldn't help but be enraged by this. I cite a ****ing scholarly journal, and that means it was reviewed by numerous professionals in the ****ing field over a course of maybe a year. And then you come and say it's wrong just because you disagree with it. You can't disagree with fact for ****s sake.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Crowquill
Just because thats the public view of emo, doesn't mean its true. The public view of punk is good charlotte and simple plan. Just because the media took a genre and used it for their own benefit doesn't mean everyone needs to give in and say rites of spring isn't emo anymore my chemical romance is.
Look, the definition of punk EVOLVED! Just like emo did, how can you not understand this simple fact. Simple Plan and Good Charlotte ARE punk, but it's actually called punk-pop. And someone also said that Black Sabbath weren't metal. Deary me, just because metal has evolved doesn't mean that Sabbath weren't the ****ing definitive heavy metal band, or perhaps Led Zeppelin were, but whatever. If you still don't understand why you're 100% wrong then I give up.


PS: I love you Urban.

bungalow 03-09-2006 10:28 PM
Urban isnt agreeing with you either.
And apparently these professionals had no idea what they were talking about...much like you

Don 03-09-2006 10:29 PM
Urban at least understands what I'm saying. So if you think I'm wrong, how about back it up with something as credible as my reference.

bungalow 03-09-2006 10:30 PM
Wow, whoever wrote that is an idiot.
Unless my eyes are decieving me, that "professional" just said that Atmosphere was emo.....


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